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How to be a good riding buddy (Revzilla - Common Tread)
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EmptySea Offline
Lives On Two Wheels

Chicagoland, USA
Posts: 7,004
Joined: Jun 2013
Post: #11
RE: How to be a good riding buddy (Revzilla - Common Tread)
First off... is Holiday Inn Express or Comfort Inn the "fancy" one? LOL

My touring trips are usually, although not always, with a group of couples. That is a bit different than having a single riding buddy on a ride. I have a riding buddy, Fran, who generally prefers to ride by himself, at a higher rate of speed, and for longer distances. He is a very experienced rider and we talked about having to flip a 'switch' mentally when riding with others. I think that's what the author of this article is saying.

My main riding buddies for day rides are my brother-in-law Tony, and my friends Glen and Mike and, of course, my wife Cheryl. We seem to be in sync on most, if not all of the items mentioned in the article except that we only line up side-by-side at stop signs. I like to think that we have each other's back when something bad happens or looks like it might. Actually, I feel the same way about riding with The Ferret, although, we've only ridden together (without a group) maybe 3 or 4 times. He's predictable and I can ride his ride--or maybe it's more that he and I can adapt enough to ride OUR ride.

I understand Guth's comments about when concern about your buddies distracts you from the business of riding your bike. There is a balance point, though. It took me a long time to find it and it helps a lot that I tend to lead riders who I trust and whose riding styles I understand. I don't check my mirrors for them as often now as did when I first was leading. Now I just ride like I'm riding a 100' long bike with 5 passengers. LOL. That's a funny image, but it keeps me properly spaced in traffic and I ride with the confidence that my "passengers" will stay behind me and will not "fall off". It takes some extra focus, but being able to talk to someone about where we've been and what we've seen when we stop makes it worth the effort.

MTC

"If you can’t go home again, at least you can enjoy the ride” — Peter Egan


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03-02-2018 10:28 AM
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The ferret Offline
Forum Moderator

Ohio
Posts: 31,283
Joined: Apr 2013
Post: #12
RE: How to be a good riding buddy (Revzilla - Common Tread)
I was invited to write a piece for the Goldwing Riders Assoc one time (and only one time lol). So I chose to write about group riding. Not the same as finding a solo riding buddy, but many of the issues that come up are the same. Here's the article I wrote


Flying Solo

When Todd asked me to pen a piece for this newsletter, I wondered what I could possibly say that would be of interest to a group of Goldwing enthusiasts. After all I don’t own a Goldwing, although I have ridden early iterations. Two of my brothers have owned Goldwings. I did have one or two as demos during the 17 years I spent in the motorcycle industry. My current rides include a 2006 Honda ST 1300, a 2000 Honda 750 Nighthawk, and a 1981 Yamaha XS650 twin. In the garage we also have a 2008 Yamaha Majesty 400 scooter that belongs to my wife and a vintage 1972 U7E Yamaha 70 scooter that belonged to my mother before her passing. I bought my first motorcycle, an Italian Aermacchi Harley Davidson 50 in 1965. Since then, I have owned somewhere in the neighborhood of 45 motorcycles including multiple Honda’s, Yamaha’s, Suzuki’s, Kawasaki’s, Harley Davidson’s plus a Triumph and a BSA. We’ve also had a couple Moto Guzzi’s, a Ducati and a KTM in the family. I come from a motorcycling family. My father rode, my mother rode, I have two brothers that ride and a sister that used to ride. My wife rides, our son rides, his wife rides, her father and mother both ride, her cousin rides, her brother in law rides. My sister’s two sons both ride. My wife’s brother rides, one of my wife’s sister and her husband ride, her nephew rides and a son in law on that side of the family also rides. I tell you this only so you know I am a motorcycle enthusiast coming from a motorcycling background, not loyal to one brand or model, but to all motorcycles in general. I am constantly searching for the next motorcycle to park in the garage. My wife has caught the fever as well, having her eye on either a new Suzuki Gladius, or an Aprilia Mana. Hmm, we’ve never had an Aprilia in the family before. That might be neat.

Anyhow I thought about penning a piece lamenting the lack of UJM’s these days, or how today technology is is passing most of us by, or how the price of new motorcycles has raised so exorbitantly that the latest luxo-tourer from Honda or BMW costs more than a similarly equipped automobile. I thought about a piece on how the parts guys at most shops are clueless and the mechanics uncaring, inept and ridiculously expensive. I could have written about the dozens of motorcycle shops I have gone into and was able to wander around for 10 or 15 minutes before leaving without anyone having spoken to me at all. I could write about how the dealers refuse to carry accessory inventory, are willing to order you something at retail, but get po'd if you decline their offer and order it yourself online at a discount. How statistically speaking we have a greater risk of dying in a car accident than on a motorcycle but no one advocates wearing Snell approved helmets or clothing with CE armor while driving automobiles, or that riding anything larger than a 125 cc bike because “it’s more economical than driving a car” is a myth. But I’m not going to write about any of those things, at least not in this piece. Maybe if this piece is well received, Todd will invite me back and I’ll write about one or more of those subjects. No, I am going to write about something dear to the hearts of most Goldwing riders. The subject of this piece will be group riding, or more accurately, why I don’t. So…here we go.

One of the things I’ve observed about modern days motorcyclists is their propensity to gather with riders of the same brand/type of motorcycle. I guess this is natural. If you observe a gaggle of Canada geese, a herd of Zebras, a pod of killer whales, or a bevy of Monarch butterflies, it is quite obvious that nature intends for us to hang with those who most closely resemble ourselves. In motorcycling terms that translates to a gaggle of Goldwings, a herd of Harleys, a bevy of Beemers, or a pod of pick one… FZ-1’s, SV’s, ZRX’s or VTX’s etc, etc. I’m sure you get my drift.

Although I can appreciate the urge to play with others, I usually eschew crowds, especially when it comes to riding motorcycles. I like riding with one other person on occasion, and can tolerate two more every great once in a while, and actually went on vacation with three others last year, but prefer to ride alone most of the time. I consider a group ride, a ride that involves anything over 4 bikes. Now, I have ridden with several large groups and by large I mean about 15 ST riders one time, and another time with about 35, mostly Goldwing riders. The experience only reiterated to me why I prefer flying solo. Allow me to list the top 10 reasons for riding alone.

# 1. “Start your ride, when YOU decide.”

Some people are naturally early risers, others not so much so. Some want breakfast before taking off, others after riding for 50-100 miles. Waiting for a group to decide when you are taking off is just plain maddening.

# 2. “I’ve got gas.”

It never ceases to amaze me how many people show up for a ride needing gas. If I know I’m going riding the next day, I make sure to fill up the night before. Even if I’m riding alone. Riding for 5 or 10 minutes before pulling into a gas station, shutting everything down, taking off my gloves, getting out my credit card, filling up, getting suited up again and firing the bike back up is not my idea of a great way to start a ride. Sitting on my bike (which was ready to roll when I showed up) for a group of people to fill up, run inside to pay and pee one last time, puts me in a really foul mood.

# 3. “Table for ONE please.”

The last time I went on a large group ride, the lunch stop was scheduled at a particular restaurant at a certain time. No reservations mind you. When we arrived at the lunch destination, guys were putting their side stands down and jumping off their bikes before their motors had even quit. They were literally running for the front door. When I asked another rider why they were running it was explained that “some people” wanted to be at or near the front of the line so they could be seated and served first. Some people were actually done eating while others were waiting in line to be seated. How rude is that? Riding solo you have the option of WHEN to stop for lunch, as well as the option of riding to another restaurant should the line be too long… or you don’t feel like running. Eating solo can be done in less than 30 minutes most of the time. I think that group took 1 ½ - 2 hours to get everybody in, fed and back on their bikes. Also the fewer people involved the easier to choose which establishment, and which type of eatery to visit, from fast food, to Mom & Pops, to upscale restaurants. Sometimes all I want is a burger and fries. Other times I want a big ol’ steak, baked potato and a vegetable…and maybe a piece of fruit pie ala mode. Group riding doesn’t allow for that option.

# 4. “I’ve got to PEE.”

This one is pretty self explanatory. When you have to go, you have to go. Why let a group decide when you get to pull off and relieve yourself? Again, on the last big ride, things were finally rolling smoothly after the lunch fiasco. All of a sudden we pulled into a gas station. I knew nobody could need gas yet, we hadn’t gone 50 miles since the last gas stop. Again, guys threw their side stands down and took off running for the building. The explanation this time was that some people had been screaming into their CB’s for the last 20 miles that they needed to pee, and upon stopping, “some people” didn’t want to wait in line for 30 people at what, no doubt, was a single urinal restroom. This doesn’t make any sense to me, someone else deciding when I get to pee. Ridiculous.

# 5. “Ooooh a VISTA”

I take lots of pictures. On my last trip down the Blue Ridge Parkway to Deals Gap and back, I took a little over 700 photos. It often takes 10 pictures to get 1 outstanding photo. It’s impossible to document a ride in pictures with any justice when riding with a group. You just can’t stop when you want or pull over when you see an outstanding view.

# 6a. “Man it felt great to blast through that series of turns”.

Oh wait, you can’t blast anywhere because you are following the 20 or more guys ahead of you, and leading the 15 guys behind you, all riding at the group pace. A pace which is usually geared to the slowest rider in the group.

# 6b. “That was so much fun, think I’ll turn around and run it one more time”.

Nope sorry, can’t do that either. You must stay in line and stay with the group. Riding solo I can run that series of turns until I get bored, or until I run it perfectly in my own mind. Then I can ride somewhere else, or run it again if I so choose. My choice.

# 7. “My butt’s tired.”

When riding solo if you feel like pulling over to give your buttocks some relief, or change from regular prescription glasses to sun glasses, or you want to take a swig out of your water bottle, you just do it. Want to sit on a wall at an overlook for a few minutes and enjoy the view- you just do it. I don’t want to rest when the ride captain says rest, or sit and rest where he says, or quit resting and ride when he says. I want to decide those things for myself.

# 8 “Ok, I’m done.”

Some times I feel like riding 500 miles in a day. Other days, two hundred is plenty depending on what I want to stop and see, or when I got on the road, or get held up due to traffic or weather conditions. Sometimes I pull off the road at 4 PM and find a room, rest a bit, walk around a little town, go to a nice restaurant for dinner, go to a movie etc. Other times I ride until well past dark if I’m feeling in the mood to ride, the weather is warm, the moon is full, or if I really need to reach a destination that night...it just depends. I get off the road when I want to get off the road.

# 9. “Any rooms at the Inn?”

Sometimes I just want a cheap bed in a flea bag hotel to crash for the night, but sometimes I like the ambiance of a quaint Bed and Breakfast. Other times I want to be pampered with a suite and a Jacuzzi in my room. The more people involved in the “where do ya want to crash for the night? question, the harder it is going to be to find accommodations to begin with, and the less likely the room is going to turn out like you had hoped for.

# 10. Ahhh FREEDOM!”

Human beings are notoriously poor at getting along. Some cultures have been hating, and killing each other for over a thousand years. Heck, one half of the marriages in America fail every year, many lasting only 6 months AFTER having promised undying love to each other for the rest of their lives. Every single job, club, organization or internet forum I have been involved with has been poisoned by egos, cliques, and petty jealousies. While some members feel appreciated, others feel neglected or ignored. The greater the number of members, the greater the number of problems. The same goes with group rides. Group dynamics places certain pressure on individuals and much like the pecking order in a chicken coop, fighting and intimidating is usually required to sort this out. Pressure breeds malcontent. Different schedules for riding, eating, resting, taking pictures, relieving bladders or any number of seemingly insignificant details that make up a ride can become extremely frustrating for certain individuals (like me for instance) which is why, for the most part, I fly solo. I just do not have it in my physiological make up to give up my freedom to the group.

In summation, I understand many of you actually enjoy group rides and the group dynamics. I’d be curious to know how many of you that do, are the “Alpha Riders”, the ride planners, ride captains or ride near the front of the pack (just a theory that I have). Anyhow, I don’t expect this little piece to cause you any epiphanies or cause you to change your motorcycling style in any way whatsoever. And, although I’m not a gambling man, I’d bet on your next group ride, or the one after that, when you are waiting for others to get ready to ride, or sitting at the gas station waiting for others to fill up, as you are standing behind 30 others in line at the restaurant, or holding it while you are waiting for the next planned bathroom stop, while riding at a monotonous pace through a wonderful stretch of curves, when riding when you’d rather be resting or resting when you’d rather be riding, when you blast past something you’d really like to stop and take a picture of or when you are trying to digest the burritos the group decided to have for dinner while lying in a sunken bed, when you’d rather be soaking in your Jacuzzi after a nice prime rib dinner, that you’ll think back about this piece and maybe consider making a solo ride or two.

Ride safe,

Mickey

.
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2014 DLX (the pleasure horse)
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03-02-2018 10:37 AM
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Nortoon Offline
High Mileage

Ottawa, Ontario, Canada
Posts: 1,409
Joined: Jan 2015
Post: #13
RE: How to be a good riding buddy (Revzilla - Common Tread)
In the early 80s I was elected President of a 150 member motorcycle touring club. Riding in large groups was stressful and dangerous especially on two lane highways. So I recommend on long trips people split up into smaller groups of 3 or 4 motorcycles with people who had similar riding styles. That worked well.

Penny and I rode alone on long trips. We started when we wanted, ate where and when we pleased, and didn't have to worry about distracted motorcyclists in front or behind us.

The exception was a trip to a Goldwing Rally in Lake of the Ozarks west of St. Louis. There were 5 of us on 3 Goldwings. Things went well until we passed over the main street of Terra Haute, Indiana. We suggested stopping there because there was hotel and restaurants right there. The leader of the group wanted to go to the next town.

The next town had neither a restaurant or motel. He stubbornly set out of for the next town. The rest of us went back to Terra Haute. We were in the hotel swimming pool by the time he and his girlfriend finally showed up.

Fast forward about 30 years. I had just returned to motorcycling after a 25 year hiatus and signed up for a group ride to raise money for the Canadian Guide Dogs for the Blind School. It turned out to be a huge group of several large clubs. As I did not belong I ended up in the middle of two packs of unfamiliar motorcyclists. It was uncomfortable riding closely between these two by two columns of bikes. Then second pack decided to pass the first making several unsafe moves to do so. I pulled over until they all disappeared.

After that I got lost so the ride not all that enjoyable. Although I did learn about a few new interesting roads close to home that I now use.

After the ride, no one spoke to me as I did not belong to their clubs. I realized right then you can't go back.

So now I ride alone and thoroughly enjoy it. Oddly enough I am often approached by other mature motorcyclists at different rest stops as soon as I remove my helmet. After chatting about our bikes and the good old days we all go our separate ways. I guess we have all learned there is more freedom riding where you want to go at whatever pace you want to ride that day.

2017 CB1100 EX
03-02-2018 10:38 AM
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The ferret Offline
Forum Moderator

Ohio
Posts: 31,283
Joined: Apr 2013
Post: #14
RE: How to be a good riding buddy (Revzilla - Common Tread)
(03-02-2018 10:28 AM)EmptySea Wrote:  First off... is Holiday Inn Express or Comfort Inn the "fancy" one? LOL

ROFL ok Mr fancy pants.

Holiday Inn express is the fancy one. We usually pay about $120 a night for a Holiday Inn Express. About $80 a night for a Comfort Inn. Both have beds, showers, TV's and Continental Breakfasts. Everything I require. One just costs 50% more.

BTW my wife would prefer the Holiday Inn Express as well, and sometimes I give in, but sometimes I don't. I normally just want a shower, watch some TV and go to sleep after a day on the road. Doesn't need to be all hoity-toity.

.
Defender of the Realm
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(This post was last modified: 03-02-2018 10:56 AM by The ferret.)
03-02-2018 10:55 AM
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EmptySea Offline
Lives On Two Wheels

Chicagoland, USA
Posts: 7,004
Joined: Jun 2013
Post: #15
RE: How to be a good riding buddy (Revzilla - Common Tread)
My wife prefers under $100 and no bedbugs. Otherwise, she stresses about the expense and doesn't sleep.

I paid a bit more for the hotel in St. Charles, MO because it was such a short walk to downtown. Otherwise, I'm usually in the <$100 club.

Sometime, Cheryl and I will camp on a motorcycle ride, but my other riding friends have ZERO interest in that. I found (I think through this forum) a pretty nice collapsible cot that's easy to carry on the bike and possibly could be used as a cane the next morning.

MTC

"If you can’t go home again, at least you can enjoy the ride” — Peter Egan


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03-02-2018 11:43 AM
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paulw Offline
1st Service Completed

USA
Posts: 65
Joined: Apr 2017
Post: #16
RE: How to be a good riding buddy (Revzilla - Common Tread)
I take an annual trip with two friends. We have been riding together for 15 years. In fact with one of them it has been 40+ years. I trust them completely. We never ride side by side and always keep enough distance to stop without over running the bike in front. We have slightly different paces and if one of us sprints a bit ahead we just let him go if it is outside our comfort zone. If he gets too far ahead he just stops and waits for the other two.

Other than that I prefer to ride alone.
03-02-2018 12:04 PM
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LongRanger Offline
Been There

Evergreen, CO
Posts: 4,220
Joined: Aug 2015
Post: #17
RE: How to be a good riding buddy (Revzilla - Common Tread)
Nortoon, I'm with you. On the multi-day group rides I've organized, I provide a suggested route sheet, cell phone numbers, and the location of that night's hotel reservations. We'll enjoy breakfast together but after that folks are welcome to split off, ride their own route, stop when they like, whatever they want if they're not interested in following someone else. There are no hurt feelings. Always ride your own ride. See you tonight!

Ride more. Worry less. Tongue
‘12 BMW R1200R Classic
'15 BMW R1200RT
(This post was last modified: 03-02-2018 12:17 PM by LongRanger.)
03-02-2018 12:07 PM
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EmptySea Offline
Lives On Two Wheels

Chicagoland, USA
Posts: 7,004
Joined: Jun 2013
Post: #18
RE: How to be a good riding buddy (Revzilla - Common Tread)
Big difference between riding in a large group than riding with one, or even a few riders especially if you know the riders well. I think small groups of very familiar riders are essentially the same as the "riding buddy" to which the author refers. I enjoy riding alone. I really do, but sharing my ride with someone or with a few someones has its own joy. I have never lead a very large group, but I did lead a group of about 10 people, most of whom I did not know, on a day ride in Wisconsin. I had a decent time, but it wasn't all that fun and it was more stressful than I would have liked.

MTC

"If you can’t go home again, at least you can enjoy the ride” — Peter Egan


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03-02-2018 01:50 PM
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The ferret Offline
Forum Moderator

Ohio
Posts: 31,283
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Post: #19
RE: How to be a good riding buddy (Revzilla - Common Tread)
wow Sea I was going to ask you to lead the group rides in Berea lol

I agree and in that piece I wrote for the GW people I considered a group ride, anything over 4. Sharing the ride with a couple of people with common habits and expectations can be a real treat. Our Fall Men's Trips are just such an event with usually 3 or 4 that share habits and riding styles and it's always a pleasure and looked forward to. This year we are headed back to West Virginia.

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03-02-2018 02:12 PM
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EmptySea Offline
Lives On Two Wheels

Chicagoland, USA
Posts: 7,004
Joined: Jun 2013
Post: #20
RE: How to be a good riding buddy (Revzilla - Common Tread)
I'd be happy to lead a ride or two in Berea, Ferret. I even promise not to speed.. very much. The ferret

MTC

"If you can’t go home again, at least you can enjoy the ride” — Peter Egan


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03-02-2018 02:56 PM
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