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Moto head on collision
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The ferret Offline
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Ohio
Posts: 31,277
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Post: #31
RE: Moto head on collision
(07-24-2016 08:21 AM)EmptySea Wrote:  1 motorcycle accident per day over any 11 mile stretch is a lot, but the likelihood that an individual rider traveling through this 11 mile stretch will be that one is tiny, and that's using the highest monthly crash number and lowest average number of vehicles that I could find. A rider's chance of being in a crash there is really very small. It is reasonable to assume that a rider who stays in his lane, is reasonable experienced, and obeys something close to the posted speed limit reduce their chances of a crash even further.

I agree, and statistically motorcyclists in general have a very small chance of being involved in a crash given the number of miles of highway we have in this country. And yes assuming a rider hasn't been imbibing, stays in his lane, is reasonably experienced and obeys close to the posted speed limit, that will reduce their chance significantly.

Given that, it does not make a good argument for ATGATT, yet we preach it all the time. Wearing an approved helmet increases the chances that if you are that unlucky 1, that you will survive, but certainly doesn't guarantee it.

Fate

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07-24-2016 08:46 AM
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LongRanger Offline
Been There

Evergreen, CO
Posts: 4,220
Joined: Aug 2015
Post: #32
RE: Moto head on collision
Unless I'm misreading your comment about ATGATT, and I think I am, I disagree with it. Presumably, the Harley ride was sober, staying within the speed limit, staying in his lane, etc., but was still involved in an accident through no fault of his own. ATGATT would have probably made his day a bit less painful. So, while I completely agree about riding sober, staying within the speed limit, possessing sufficient riding skills, etc. as a prudent way to reduce the likelihood of causing an accident, there's always the "other guy" who might get you. That's why you need ATGATT.

Ride more. Worry less. Tongue
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(This post was last modified: 07-24-2016 09:36 AM by LongRanger.)
07-24-2016 09:19 AM
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4 Paws Offline
High Mileage

MM 199 on BRP (Fancy Gap VA)
Posts: 1,154
Joined: Jun 2015
Post: #33
RE: Moto head on collision
Seems to be two frequent themes repeated in the online crash photos - riders in over their head and all too frequently someone in the wrong lane, maybe that's just one theme.

Best thing I learned from my dog: “Never pass up the opportunity to go for a joy ride". Dan D.
07-24-2016 09:29 AM
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EmptySea Offline
Lives On Two Wheels

Chicagoland, USA
Posts: 7,004
Joined: Jun 2013
Post: #34
RE: Moto head on collision
I like the t-shirt naming caution, but I would change "avoiding" to "approaching with caution". I'd be interested in seeing what the ST rider had to say about the crash.

My point in my last post was that the perils of riding on The Dragon are often overstated. People need to recognize the dangers, but not be preoccupied by them. Like riding in general, one ought not to do it if it terrifies. If you ride your ride, and if that ride is a safe one, the probability of a crash is infinitesimally small. oh, and it's a fun ride, too.

I suspect that Ferret was just pointing out that because of the minimal chance of a crash, a person could ride for his whole life without ever having to take advantage of the protective gear. True enough, but I'm more inclined to try to dress for the possibility of a crash than to not. As you will read in my next Seat Time installment, I have made the choice of comfort over safety on occasion and my rationale was that the chances of having a crash in the time span and distance of my ride was tiny. I gambled and won that time. It will be a while before I take that same bet again, though.

MTC

"If you can’t go home again, at least you can enjoy the ride” — Peter Egan


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07-24-2016 09:35 AM
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LongRanger Offline
Been There

Evergreen, CO
Posts: 4,220
Joined: Aug 2015
Post: #35
RE: Moto head on collision
EmptySea, thanks for clarifying. I agree.

Ride more. Worry less. Tongue
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07-24-2016 09:41 AM
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The ferret Offline
Forum Moderator

Ohio
Posts: 31,277
Joined: Apr 2013
Post: #36
RE: Moto head on collision
I think you could pick out "any" 11 miles of the Cherohala or the BRP and the stats would make the 11 mile stretch of US 129 aka the Dragon seem like a blood bath in comparison. On the Dragon, even though as MTC pointed out statistically I would have a very small chance of something happening, I want to be wearing protective gear head to toe and I do every time I ride it. On the Cherahola or BRP I would find just wearing a helmet an acceptable risk. YMMV

I would never discourage someone from wearing gear (personal choice and all) and there are certain places is in this country where I would never consider NOT wearing full gear including a Hi Viz vest (mostly major cities...freeways etc). Where I live just doesn't happen to be one of them, and maybe geography accounts for how paranoid people get which shapes their opinions about gear. I live in a relatively safe place to ride a motorcycle. Out in the country, not much traffic, not many intersections or stop lights, relatively slow speed limits. I don't drink, I am a very experienced and confident rider, I stay in my lane, I don't tailgate, I don't speed more than +5. I will venture forth (as my wife and I did yesterday and today) with helmets as our only protective gear because that is the one piece of gear designed to save my life in an accident in the statistically small chance that one would happen (well I had boots on as well, but only because they make me taller, therefore easier to reach the ground, and it's easier on my toe to upshift in them than gym shoes). I weigh the risks and ride within my comfort zone. Maybe you only feel comfortable when totally geared up, and that's fine. I felt quite at ease riding as I did today.

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(This post was last modified: 07-24-2016 11:31 AM by The ferret.)
07-24-2016 11:18 AM
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Ulvetanna Away
Road Warrior

USA
Posts: 1,696
Joined: Apr 2016
Post: #37
RE: Moto head on collision
(07-24-2016 09:41 AM)LongRanger Wrote:  EmptySea, thanks for clarifying. I agree.
so do i
07-24-2016 12:03 PM
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EmptySea Offline
Lives On Two Wheels

Chicagoland, USA
Posts: 7,004
Joined: Jun 2013
Post: #38
RE: Moto head on collision
so just rode to the cigar shop. 3 miles by car. 10 miles by motorcycle. Boots, gloves, helmet, jeans, work shirt. Taking the chance that I just said would be a long time coming. I assure you that I would not take that same chance on 10 miles of US129, even if it was 100 degrees in the shade.

MTC

"If you can’t go home again, at least you can enjoy the ride” — Peter Egan


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07-24-2016 12:36 PM
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kmoney Offline
High Mileage

Vancouver, BC
Posts: 908
Joined: Sep 2014
Post: #39
Moto head on collision
This just happened this morning on one of our local riding roads straight and generally non-s ketch stretch of road -- the sneaker on the road speaks to the gear the rider was wearing.

İmage

I'd personally never take the chance and usually have at least riding jeans, a full-face and an armoured jacket. To each his/her own though... Thankfully, this person survived with what could be considered minor injuries given the circumstances and severity (Air Ambulance with broken ribs and 2 broken arms).
07-24-2016 01:23 PM
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The ferret Offline
Forum Moderator

Ohio
Posts: 31,277
Joined: Apr 2013
Post: #40
RE: Moto head on collision
really that's all he got out of that? Lucky lucky fellow. That looks nasty. That car is crunched and the bike blown up

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07-24-2016 03:47 PM
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